Every time I hear about this conversion I get annoyed
The reason - Several years ago the Seig X2 Mini-mill used to come with a gas strut as standard, (I bought one just before they changed).
OK it wasn't strong enough to fully support the head but it was far better than the POS "improvement" they made in the lever arm arrangement on current models which is weak, gets in the way and reduces Z axis travel.
Why couldn't they have just fitted a bigger rated strut and sorted the problem, I suspect the big distributors wanted a cheaper basic mill
Gerry
Leeds UK
To: GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com
From: grimmrlg@yahoo.com
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 13:29:50 +0000
Subject: [GrizHFMinimill] Re: Air spring and spring
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The reason - Several years ago the Seig X2 Mini-mill used to come with a gas strut as standard, (I bought one just before they changed).
OK it wasn't strong enough to fully support the head but it was far better than the POS "improvement" they made in the lever arm arrangement on current models which is weak, gets in the way and reduces Z axis travel.
Why couldn't they have just fitted a bigger rated strut and sorted the problem, I suspect the big distributors wanted a cheaper basic mill
Gerry
Leeds UK
To: GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com
From: grimmrlg@yahoo.com
Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 13:29:50 +0000
Subject: [GrizHFMinimill] Re: Air spring and spring
Here is the 80lb gas spring I used on my HF mill.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/20-Columbia-Gas-Strut-Shock-Prop-Rod-Ram-Cylinder-Arm-REP-Spring-Lift-SL-34-80-/320820181279?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item4ab25f791f
You'll want to order the ball end mounts for both ends if mounting on the side like I did.
I measured the force required to move the head upward without the torsion spring at 70 lb so anything less won't be enough to keep the backlash out of the rack/pinion. You do need to deal with the nature of the head to always want to rise back to the top but I've gotten used to it now. In fact I often release the quill handle and allow it to return to the top where it comes to a nice cushioned stop due to the gas spring end cushions. Milling is much nicer since I can advance or retract the head without worrying about the backlash.
The 20" length collapses to 12" but I found I actually got 8.5" of travel, perfect for the standard rack on the HF mill. A mounting similar to the Little Machine Shop version inside the column would be a more centered counterbalance, but this offcenter one works fine for me. I removed the top stop bolt to get just a bit more travel, the gas spring provides the top stop.
Some pics at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GrizHFMinimill/photos/album/2130350934/pic/1702507984/view?picmode=&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc
Thanks to Paul Gloger for the inspiration for this mod.
--- In GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com, "miner49r" <miner_49r@...> wrote:
>
> http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=767&PARTPG=INLMK3&PMITEM=319-9761
>
> --- In GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com, "bbass408" <bbass408@> wrote:
> >
> > Rick is running with an 80lb gas spring as I recall from another post. He can follow up with details if he reads this one.
> >
> > One thing I remember him mentioning is that that always applies upward pressure to the Z rack since 80lb far exceeds the 30-40lb estimates of the weight of the head.
> >
> > Finding a gas spring with the exact length, extension, and weight specs for our mills didn't seem so easy. Perhaps folks can post back with specific products they've had good luck with.
> >
> > In one of the photo folders, someone extended the top mount for the gas spring above the head with some modified angle iron. That allowed use of a longer spring with enough extension to give you the full travel on the Z. That was cool. The mill is blue in those pics.
> >
> > All that said, I like the webbing pulley setup. It's so clean and compact, and seems to work just fine for our little mills. I just might not have the room behind the mill to put the counterweight. So, maybe I'll try the angle iron idea.
> >
> > --- In GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com, "Rob Potter" <rob@> wrote:
> > >
> > > So in that vein, has anyone ever replaced the gas spring in the LMS kit with
> > > one that's stronger? Which is to say, simply used their mounting hardware?
> > > I'm working on a counterweight system, and have purchased the longer rack
> > > from LMS, but I don't want to overlook other options that may have worked
> > > for someone else.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Rob
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > From: GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com [mailto:GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com]
> > > On Behalf Of bbass408
> > > Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 1:07 PM
> > > To: GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [GrizHFMinimill] Re: Air spring and spring
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I bought the kit and just installed the new rack for now. I'm more inclined
> > > to wait and do a counterweight like in the other threads today yesterday.
> > >
> > > If you used both, you probably would not get too much head lift to cause
> > > inconvenience. But, most people buy that kit so they can get rid of the
> > > existing torsion spring which:
> > > * Limits downward travel.
> > > * Can hit big workpieces on its way down.
> > > * Has a locking ring on the right side of the column which makes it harder
> > > to install Z axis DRO.
> > >
> > > --- In GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com
> > > <mailto:GrizHFMinimill%40yahoogroups.com> , "eedowens" <eedowens@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I just recieved the LMS spring conversion and wondering has anyone just
> > > left the tortion spring on along with the air spring and if not what
> > > problems would this create? thanks ED
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
http://www.ebay.com/itm/20-Columbia-Gas-Strut-Shock-Prop-Rod-Ram-Cylinder-Arm-REP-Spring-Lift-SL-34-80-/320820181279?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item4ab25f791f
You'll want to order the ball end mounts for both ends if mounting on the side like I did.
I measured the force required to move the head upward without the torsion spring at 70 lb so anything less won't be enough to keep the backlash out of the rack/pinion. You do need to deal with the nature of the head to always want to rise back to the top but I've gotten used to it now. In fact I often release the quill handle and allow it to return to the top where it comes to a nice cushioned stop due to the gas spring end cushions. Milling is much nicer since I can advance or retract the head without worrying about the backlash.
The 20" length collapses to 12" but I found I actually got 8.5" of travel, perfect for the standard rack on the HF mill. A mounting similar to the Little Machine Shop version inside the column would be a more centered counterbalance, but this offcenter one works fine for me. I removed the top stop bolt to get just a bit more travel, the gas spring provides the top stop.
Some pics at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GrizHFMinimill/photos/album/2130350934/pic/1702507984/view?picmode=&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc
Thanks to Paul Gloger for the inspiration for this mod.
--- In GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com, "miner49r" <miner_49r@...> wrote:
>
> http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=767&PARTPG=INLMK3&PMITEM=319-9761
>
> --- In GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com, "bbass408" <bbass408@> wrote:
> >
> > Rick is running with an 80lb gas spring as I recall from another post. He can follow up with details if he reads this one.
> >
> > One thing I remember him mentioning is that that always applies upward pressure to the Z rack since 80lb far exceeds the 30-40lb estimates of the weight of the head.
> >
> > Finding a gas spring with the exact length, extension, and weight specs for our mills didn't seem so easy. Perhaps folks can post back with specific products they've had good luck with.
> >
> > In one of the photo folders, someone extended the top mount for the gas spring above the head with some modified angle iron. That allowed use of a longer spring with enough extension to give you the full travel on the Z. That was cool. The mill is blue in those pics.
> >
> > All that said, I like the webbing pulley setup. It's so clean and compact, and seems to work just fine for our little mills. I just might not have the room behind the mill to put the counterweight. So, maybe I'll try the angle iron idea.
> >
> > --- In GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com, "Rob Potter" <rob@> wrote:
> > >
> > > So in that vein, has anyone ever replaced the gas spring in the LMS kit with
> > > one that's stronger? Which is to say, simply used their mounting hardware?
> > > I'm working on a counterweight system, and have purchased the longer rack
> > > from LMS, but I don't want to overlook other options that may have worked
> > > for someone else.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Rob
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > From: GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com [mailto:GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com]
> > > On Behalf Of bbass408
> > > Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 1:07 PM
> > > To: GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [GrizHFMinimill] Re: Air spring and spring
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I bought the kit and just installed the new rack for now. I'm more inclined
> > > to wait and do a counterweight like in the other threads today yesterday.
> > >
> > > If you used both, you probably would not get too much head lift to cause
> > > inconvenience. But, most people buy that kit so they can get rid of the
> > > existing torsion spring which:
> > > * Limits downward travel.
> > > * Can hit big workpieces on its way down.
> > > * Has a locking ring on the right side of the column which makes it harder
> > > to install Z axis DRO.
> > >
> > > --- In GrizHFMinimill@yahoogroups.com
> > > <mailto:GrizHFMinimill%40yahoogroups.com> , "eedowens" <eedowens@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I just recieved the LMS spring conversion and wondering has anyone just
> > > left the tortion spring on along with the air spring and if not what
> > > problems would this create? thanks ED
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
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